trans cooler - Did some testing today

[Gnfanatic]

Hey guys, this weekend I dropped the trans pan to chnage fluid and filter at 12k. Since it was down I tigged a drain plug and a bung for a trans temp sensor. Unf I ran out of time and could not install the trans cooler. So since the gauge is installed I did some testing on the stock cooler.
This is what I did so far:
Highway driving
2300 RPM
75 MPH steady for 20 miles
Trans Temp: 185-189 degree's
Outside Temp: 60 Degree's
When I got off the highway I hit a red light and the temp went to 192 degree's. Now dont forget it is only 60 degree's outside and I was driving normal. This past summer had 100 degree days and well sometimes I pushed the truck. I would say the trans temp hit 225-235 those days. I really think a trans cooler in these trucks is Imperative. I will have more tests coming before and afte cooler. If anyone has idea's let me know.

Thanks
Ralph

[bbradyc5]

This is definitely worthy information for everyone. Trans cooler is a must if doing a TC install IMO.:yes:

[Hawaiian SS]

B&M 70264 seems to be a good choice.

I have also heard some guys with the 4L60-E in their S-10's and Camaro's use the "pressure port" on the driver's side of the trans near the linkage to measure temp as well. They say it measures "true temp", whatever that is. This port is also 1/8" pipe thread, so the sender that comes with an Auto Meter guage fits perfectly.

I do not know if our transmissions have this pressure port, but if based on the 4L60-E, they just might.

[Gnfanatic]

Hawain, I dont like that pot reaosn being is the fluid DOES NOT flow through it! it only stays there, its there for testing only not temp sensor. YOu will not get an accurate reading at that location due to the fluid not flowing.


Ralph

[VTODD]

i just got my trans gauge and cooler. as far as mounting the sendor - is it more accurate to plumb it before or after the external trans cooler?

thanks!

todd

[Gnfanatic]

todd, I put mine in the pan, reason being is that if the cooler clogs you will know it by the temps climbing. In the return line you wont., in the feed line you wont know how effect the cooler is.

[VTODD]

i think i will mount mine in the return line after the external b and m cooler. i dont want to mess with my trans. pan.

[Gnfanatic]

Do whatever makes you happy. I bought an autometer bung ($4) and my friend tigged it on. done/

[GTPprix]

Dashhawk will have trans temp support very soon ;)

[ghoster]

Dashhawk will have trans temp support very soon ;)


and when is Dashhawk gonna have I-6 support??:D :rotfl: Come on Chris, ya gotta make SOMETHING for us!!!!!!:laugh:

[Gnfanatic]

How is it going to read it chris?

[GTPprix]

appears to be a TFT PID for the T42, not a standard pid but it looks like we can grab it.

[davidrab]

Dashhawk will have trans temp support very soon ;)

Cool, my order for one should be on the way!


B&M 70264 seems to be a good choice.

I would watch out for the 70264 because of the 1.5" thickness. I tried a
70274, but it was all around to large to go in front of the radiator without
cutting things. I mocked up a 70264 with cardboard and I didn't like the
thickness. I went with a 70268 and it fit great. I would try a cardboard
mock-up before getting one.

Come to think of it, I think someone did a 70274, but I can't remember
who.

Dave

[VTODD]

Dashhawk will have trans temp support very soon ;)

Now damnit chris why couldn't you have told me this earlier :p :D Trans temp guage for sale! j/k, i think having the dashhawk and a physical sensor will be twice as good!

todd

[Gnfanatic]

Todd, you are asking for trouble becuase then they will both have different temps and make you think which one is accurate :crazy:

[VTODD]

Todd, you are asking for trouble becuase then they will both have different temps and make you think which one is accurate :crazy:

well, i plan on mounting a calculator on my a piller so i can figure the averages.........:D

:hijacked
oh, and chris, any way i can get one of your CAI's before next monday so i can have it on for me heads tune ;) ..... please :yes:

[bbradyc5]

Cool, my order for one should be on the way!




I would watch out for the 70264 because of the 1.5" thickness. I tried a
70274, but it was all around to large to go in front of the radiator without
cutting things. I mocked up a 70264 with cardboard and I didn't like the
thickness. I went with a 70268 and it fit great. I would try a cardboard
mock-up before getting one.

Come to think of it, I think someone did a 70274, but I can't remember
who.

Dave

I got a 70264 and it fits perfect. Largest you could pretty much go though.:)

appears to be a TFT PID for the T42, not a standard pid but it looks like we can grab it.

I knew you'd come through on this one Chris;)

[Gnfanatic]

I have the bigger one as well. its the biggest you can go wiht the 3/8 id piping.

[junehhan]

I suspected what you found might be the case. The transmission seems to shift nice until you start flogging it around in the city. The shift quality seems to completely change after flogging it for several blocks, as they start to get sloppy from what i've noticed. Based on what you found, i'm definately moving a tranny cooler mod up a few notches in the order in which i'll start my mods on my SUV. I know that we have a 130hp top speed, and I would hate to see how high the temperature would spike after driving at high speeds for a little while. Due to the performance nature of the TBSS, I never understood why GM didn't put an auxiliary tranny cooler on from the factory.

Hey guys, this weekend I dropped the trans pan to chnage fluid and filter at 12k. Since it was down I tigged a drain plug and a bung for a trans temp sensor. Unf I ran out of time and could not install the trans cooler. So since the gauge is installed I did some testing on the stock cooler.
This is what I did so far:
Highway driving
2300 RPM
75 MPH steady for 20 miles
Trans Temp: 185-189 degree's
Outside Temp: 60 Degree's
When I got off the highway I hit a red light and the temp went to 192 degree's. Now dont forget it is only 60 degree's outside and I was driving normal. This past summer had 100 degree days and well sometimes I pushed the truck. I would say the trans temp hit 225-235 those days. I really think a trans cooler in these trucks is Imperative. I will have more tests coming before and afte cooler. If anyone has idea's let me know.

Thanks
Ralph

[Gnfanatic]

junehhan, it amazes me to. I seriously dont think these trannies will live to 100k with these trucks. GM should have put a cooler in alot of cars but I guess to comes to cost. well, it cost me $100 for the gauge and cooler and its money well spent (and it looks good)


Ralph

[Loren]

Dashhawk will have trans temp support very soon ;)

Thats SWEET!!! :yes:

[blu ya]

Cool, my order for one should be on the way!




I would watch out for the 70264 because of the 1.5" thickness. I tried a
70274, but it was all around to large to go in front of the radiator without
cutting things. I mocked up a 70264 with cardboard and I didn't like the
thickness. I went with a 70268 and it fit great. I would try a cardboard
mock-up before getting one.

Come to think of it, I think someone did a 70274, but I can't remember
who.

Dave

I too have a 70264 and it fit just fine, about the biggest I would go with.

Tim

[Gnfanatic]

I def would rather have a gauge right on the dash that I can look at all times. With the dashhawk you would need to hit the buttons to get to the next screen to look at the trans temp numbers. I have one right now and trying to get used to it. But the damn shape of it is awkward.

Ralph

[kenmosher]

... or you customize the screen that you normally use to put the value on that screen. No buttons involved then ...

[Gnfanatic]

Ken does the screen only hold up to 4 readings ?? or can it go more? having fun here :)

[bbradyc5]

Ken does the screen only hold up to 4 readings ?? or can it go more? having fun here :)

You have the option to have up to 7 items displayed on the screen at one time!

[kenmosher]

Yep! I started a new thread so as not to hijack this one...

http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?p=206244#post206244

[junehhan]

junehhan, it amazes me to. I seriously dont think these trannies will live to 100k with these trucks. GM should have put a cooler in alot of cars but I guess to comes to cost. well, it cost me $100 for the gauge and cooler and its money well spent (and it looks good)


Ralph

As you said, money is what it boils down to after the company has done a cost/risk/benefit analysis on something. All they care is that the transmission outlives the factory warranty. If you purchase an extended warranty(I imagine not many TBSS owners did judging from the amount of modding I see), it just budgets the cost of these risks into the purchase price of it.

Luckily for us, a tranny cooler mod is one of the cheapest(and possible one of the most valuable) mods we can do for the TBSS. My only concern is whether an auxiliary tranny cooler will cause enough of a pressure drop to cause problems............

[Gnfanatic]

hit 210 degree's today in traffic . 73 degree's outside. cant wait to put cooler in. I am having a hard time finding dexron vI! Napa does not have it. Anyone know the diff between III and VI?
thanks

[bbradyc5]

Have to try the dealer for Dexron VI ... wasn't even available there when I did my cooler. No good reputable performane oil companies have it yet (royal purple, amsoil, etc.). Here's some basic info on development of Dexron VI
http://www.imakenews.com/lng/e_article000384801.cfm?x=b11,0,w

[rrmccabe]

Anyone know the diff between III and VI?
thanks


Exactly "III"

Cool, my order for one should be on the way!




I would watch out for the 70264 because of the 1.5" thickness. I tried a
70274, but it was all around to large to go in front of the radiator without
cutting things. I mocked up a 70264 with cardboard and I didn't like the
thickness. I went with a 70268 and it fit great. I would try a cardboard
mock-up before getting one.

Come to think of it, I think someone did a 70274, but I can't remember
who.

Dave

PICS !

:D

[GMtech45]

70268 here, with perfect fit. Put B&M guage in the "SS" hole plug.

[rrmccabe]

So its been a long time since I have but a tranny cooler on anything.

Is there a new plumbing method now or is it still a hack the return line deal.

Would like a tranny cooler, but want to make sure it looks like the general did it.

Rich

[bbradyc5]

So its been a long time since I have but a tranny cooler on anything.

Is there a new plumbing method now or is it still a hack the return line deal.

Would like a tranny cooler, but want to make sure it looks like the general did it.

Rich

Still gotta hack the return line, but just use couplings and bend some hard lines. Mine looks like it was factory installed.:yes:

[rrmccabe]

http://www.***********/rich/useless.gif

[rrmccabe]

Since the TB uses quick disconnect type transmissions fittings I am thinking about stopping by my dealer and ordering one of the short lines that runs from the connection near the airbox to the actual trans cooler. (shown by arrow). Just doing this to get the connectors so I dont have to cut the line to add a trans cooler. It has the male on one end, female on other.

Any other options, besides cutting the line?

http://www.***********/rich/transline.jpg

[02redhawk]

Since the TB uses quick disconnect type transmissions fittings I am thinking about stopping by my dealer and ordering one of the short lines that runs from the connection near the airbox to the actual trans cooler. (shown by arrow). Just doing this to get the connectors so I dont have to cut the line to add a trans cooler. It has the male on one end, female on other.

Any other options, besides cutting the line?




Oooh! I like this idea! :yes: I may copycat and do the same....

BTW, for anyone with a Maggie installed, how'd you fit the tranny cooler next to the CCHE? I'm thinking of going with one of the "frame-rail" tranny coolers (usually are long and "thin") that could fit just to the right of the CCHE in front of the radiator, but want to hear some other options....

[bbradyc5]

http://www.***********/rich/useless.gif

Here ya go!

my cooler pics = http://s8.photobucket.com/albums/a21/bbradyc5/tranny%20cooler/?action=view&current=1162512035.pbw

[rrmccabe]

Thank you sir !

[TonyGXP]

GNfanatic!! any update after the cooler install??? have you done anymore testing?

I installed my cooler, TCI 2qt higher capacity and finned Pan (header wrapped the Y piped so it wouldn't radiate too much heat upwards into the pan), servos and TCI 3400stall Converter and tested after all was in.. unfortunately I don't have before numbers, but it was 70f and sunny out when I tested...

with DR's on and beating the piss out of it (WOT runs from a dig up through 3rd over and over) seeing how high I could get it.. Only 171f at it's peak, and that was only until the E-Fans came on, backinto the 150's and at idle 143f.. I installed my cooler on the driver's side of the condenser (11"x11"x3/4" Stacked plate Torqflo 911679 form Autozone, interesting to note the Hayden exact size & design is a 1679??? same maker?)
I need to get a gauge so I can "flip" the driver's side fan on and get a little extra cooling going to it, also I mounted it low, barely peeks out above the top of the bumper, if it was higher it would be even cooler..

here' a couple pics of the connections and the pan.. I flared the cooler lines and used high temp power steering return line instead of the cooler supplied stuff, looking at then ends of the two hoses now I know why Matt's Mechanic advised me to do so, big difference..

with the DR's on I might add, which gives the truck like a 4.90 rearend ratio..

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n141/TonyTBSS/trans-2.jpg

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n141/TonyTBSS/trans-5.jpg

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n141/TonyTBSS/trans-4.jpg

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n141/TonyTBSS/trans-19.jpg

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n141/TonyTBSS/trans-20.jpg

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n141/TonyTBSS/trans-18.jpg

[ATV PRO]

Tony, Are you runnin it at Atco this Saturday?

[TonyGXP]

Tony, Are you runnin it at Atco this Saturday?

if it runs/drives, it and I will be there:D, hopefully leaving with a new PB:) ..

[ATV PRO]

Good, Try not to blow it up in the next six days! :eek: I would think that you will be leaving with something in the 12's. You're knocking on the door and your 60 should easily get you into the next bracket.! If not we should take Matt out back and throw him a beatin!! JK

[TonyGXP]

Good, Try not to blow it up in the next six days! :eek: I would think that you will be leaving with something in the 12's. You're knocking on the door and your 60 should easily get you into the next bracket.! If not we should take Matt out back and throw him a beatin!! JK

I know this much, the more you do to make it faster the esaier it is to break.. I am hoping with the "beefing up" (see matt's TuneTime Section here for the details) of the trans will keep me running for a long time..i know guys running N2o big shots BTW, and they're holding up, so me, not doing that, leads me to believe I still have a reliable, Daily Driven Street vehicle.... I think I will "OK" with a 12.5x, then I'm done.......


























For 06' at least:D

[Gnfanatic]

Tony, looks great man, I like that pan but sure wont fit with my SW y pipe. At least I dont think it would. I have not installed my cooler yet due to much crap going on. I will be installing it durin turkey day in NY when I visit my family (all my tools are there ). My temps have hit 205 so far after driving for miles and mile son the highway at 70 degrees roughly. So i cant wait to install the cooler. I hope you remembered to remove that socket wrench :) BTW , I am going to go to NJ next holiday weekend to visit a friend. I believe here is near ATL city.

[TuneTimePerformance]

Tony, looks great man, I like that pan but sure wont fit with my SW y pipe. At least I dont think it would. I have not installed my cooler yet due to much crap going on. I will be installing it durin turkey day in NY when I visit my family (all my tools are there ). My temps have hit 205 so far after driving for miles and mile son the highway at 70 degrees roughly. So i cant wait to install the cooler. I hope you remembered to remove that socket wrench :) BTW , I am going to go to NJ next holiday weekend to visit a friend. I believe here is near ATL city.

we call that a "RACHET":D ..... and yes after we FINALLY got the last TC bolt in it came out.. Gotta love GM's flexplate holes... on my truck one hole was .001 smaller than the rest and required some extra effort to get it through using the bigger bolts that the new TC came with:mad: :mad: ... I purposely checked the bolts in the flexplate while the trans was out, it never crossed my mind to check EACH F-ING hole since they went through w/o a problem... you live and you learn & then you use a small drill bit to get the hole bigger and viola! like a glove... (when I got home Travor from Texas Speed replied to my email with "Yeah, i had to drill a couple of my holes out before the bolt would fit".... Day late and a dollar short as they say:o ......

Back on track, i am the dyno right now and on the way down, an hour drive at 68mph trans temp was 153, coolant was at 176 up to 190 at stop lights..so much for the "160f being too cold" theory...

[TonyGXP]

obviously the above post was me, not Matt.. Dyno was a waist for me other than checking my A/F ratio (12.5-12.7) couldn't lock the trans in the 3rd (Matt's lapTop wasn't cooperating!!) and with the new converter I couldn't start pulls until 5200:eek: ..

[VTODD]

obviously the above post was me, not Matt.. Dyno was a waist for me other than checking my A/F ratio (12.5-12.7) couldn't lock the trans in the 3rd (Matt's lapTop wasn't cooperating!!) and with the new converter I couldn't start pulls until 5200:eek: ..

why were you trying to lock it? what numbers did it put down anyways?

todd

[Gnfanatic]

Tony, where did you put the temp sensor?? mine is in the pan.

[TonyGXP]

why were you trying to lock it? what numbers did it put down anyways?

todd

with the converter in there it's starting the pull waaay too high.... we aborted the runs due to the 3rd gear issue, pulls were starting at almost 5k, complete waist...

Tony, where did you put the temp sensor?? mine is in the pan.

I used the scanner Matt has ($3600), we also tested another Stock SS with no cooler and it was running in the 170's and climbing, still, after 20 mile drive, so the stock cooler is really crappy, like you already figured out..

[bbradyc5]

I thought I would post an update to this thread now that I have the DashHawk montioring trans temps. I am 2wd with a Yank3600 Stall, stock tranny, 93 Octane Tune and B&M 70264 trans cooler installed. An hour+ drive into work today (mix of city & highway & about 50 degrees outside) saw a max trans temp of 176* (this was observed in stop & go traffic on highway), cruising on highway brought it back into the 165-170 range. From what other temps people have posted, deifinitely appears cooler is doing it's job. I'll repost when we get some summer temps around here, but it is good info to have on what people are seeing in trans cooler vs non-trans cooler trucks and what influence the outside temp has on these numbers. If anyone else has numbers, post'em up.

[kenmosher]

Timely! I just was really watching mine (with the DashHawk) the other day. Ambient was 70-74 degrees ...

For the first 20 minutes of in-town errands (stop and go and short trips), it hovered around the 165 degree mark.

Got out on the Interstate for a 30 minute drive and it climbed to 185 or so. Pull off the interstate and entered traffic and saw it climb to 195-196 and GRADUALLY it dropped back to match coolant temp (190-192).

Stock cooler, stock tranny, stock fan, 92 octane tune, AWD.

[bbradyc5]

Quick update ...... commute home from work today (outside temp an amazing 75*F .... it's Detroit you know). About 45mins on highway, trans temp matched coolant temp, both around 198*C. After exiting highway into city traffic, coolant temps regulate between 204-210 and trans temps held steady around stayed between 192-196. It appears that prolonged highway driving is going to cause trans temp to match ect temp whether you have a cooler or not, but during city driving, cooler help it stay 10-20 degrees below coolant temp (possibly because fan is pulling air across trans cooler vs highway when fan is barely running?). By no means is this scientific, just reporting dashawk monitored temps thus far.