Noisy lifers, Marvel Mystery Oil, Lucas, and other additives [Archive] - Chevy TrailBlazer, TrailBlazer SS and GMC Envoy Forum

: Noisy lifers, Marvel Mystery Oil, Lucas, and other additives


Doc Brown
03-26-2008, 09:57 AM
I waited 5 months, 5k miles between oil changes on my Cadillac. I hate others, especially the "quick lube" places, touching my vehicles, and the crappy winter we had just didn't make changing sooner realistic. Last week a lifter starts to make a lot of racket. I changed oil, and found that the filter was twisted and broke apart (its a cartridge type filter). :( Well, that didn't help I'm sure! So now the lifter noise comes and goes, so I know its loosening up a bit. Changing lifters is a major deal on this car, so thats out of the question, and besides, I'm only planning on keeping it another 5 months or so.

I'm going to put 10W-40 in it to see if that helps, but I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with Marvel Mystery Oil or Lucas oil additives. I'm reading thay Lucas can work wonders on stuck lifters. I've also read some good stuff about Rislone, but I'm leary about it because its more of a cleaner.

Thoughts or suggestions?

petevw
03-26-2008, 10:03 AM
Don't have any comment on the Lucas or Rislone products, but have always heard good things about Marval. I'd try a can and see what happens....can't cost too much....IMO, I'd give it a shot.

starchief1959
03-26-2008, 11:07 AM
Ah, the old mechanic in a can. As far as your problem goes, anything from a can or bottle you dump in won't fix a mechanical problem. It will only help with problems such as carbon buildup or lubrication. If there's a mechanical problem with the lifter you'll need to replace it or live with it hoping it doesn't get worse. Best of luck in your ordeal.

stangcolts
03-26-2008, 11:24 AM
As a store manger for checker auto, I've had experince with all. Believe it or not my trailblazer was ticking, I changed my oil with royal purple 10w30 noise was gone,plus .3 mpg all the time increase. I wouldn't use any of them, just change your oil with quality oil and see what happens. If you choose to use anything use the hyper lube oil supllement. Its product guide actually calls out lucas and says why spend more on a product that does less...

ylab
03-26-2008, 11:33 AM
IF the lifter is sticking due to deposits, sludge, being clogged or having a clogged oil galley feeding it, then Marvel or Risoline may help. (But so does changing the oil and filling with a high-quality oil....which usually means lower wax and more additives). If however its worn or leaking, they aren't going to do a hole lot to help, however a thicker oil or a thickening additive may quiet it down a bit.

You mentioned that the lifter was twisted and broken a part, but that its also a pain to replace the lifter. Is the lifter still twisted and broken a part? What did you do to address that issue, was it replaced and still makes noise? - Is this the still the twisted/damaged lifter or a replacement? (If its a replacement, did you pre-lube it and prime it with oil?)

A bad lifter could potentially damage the follower (rocker), which may need replacing. - Use to happen with small block Fords all the time.

petevw
03-26-2008, 11:39 AM
You mentioned that the lifter was twisted and broken a part

No, he said the FILTER was broken and twisted apart.

Doc Brown
03-26-2008, 12:19 PM
You mentioned that the lifter was twisted and broken a part, but that its also a pain to replace the lifter. Is the lifter still twisted and broken a part? What did you do to address that issue, was it replaced and still makes noise? - Is this the still the twisted/damaged lifter or a replacement? (If its a replacement, did you pre-lube it and prime it with oil?)

Not a lifter, the oil filter. I've never seen that happen before, though I'm sure its not all that unusual. The reason changing a lifter is such a pain is due to the fact that this is an interference engine. The timing belt has to come off, as do the cam shafts (this thing has 4 overhead cams) to get at the lifters. Usually work like this doesn't bother me, but in this case, if something's just a little off when reassembled, its bye bye engine :cry:. I'd rather live with the noise than take a chance. I'm trying to fix it, I just want it a little quieter for the next few months until I sell it.

Oh, I forgot to mention that it runs great otherwise, no loss of power, no oil leaks, smoking, etc.

bartonmd
03-26-2008, 01:18 PM
If your oil filter was twisted up like that, it was more than likely either over-pressurized by a REALLY cold start, or was plugged up... Either way, it's probably gone through the over-pressure filter bypass, and you've been running unfiltered oil to your top end. It's probably a piece of something stuck in a lifter (or rather, "hydrolic valve adjuster" if it's an OHC/finger follower system)... I had a Fram filter (I know I know... all I could find at the time) on my '85 Nighthawk 700S come apart on me, and found pieces of the cardboard end cap in a lifter... Since I had run it for awhile as the noise started, then got a little worse, the lifter had literally beat itself to sh*t, and had to be replaced... If it's a piece of sludge or something in a lifter, the Marvel or any of the detergents may get it out, but I wouldn't run it too much between now and when you put the stuff in...

Mike

Robert1101
03-26-2008, 01:34 PM
I waited 5 months, 5k miles between oil changes on my Cadillac. I hate others, especially the "quick lube" places, touching my vehicles, and the crappy winter we had just didn't make changing sooner realistic. Last week a lifter starts to make a lot of racket. I changed oil, and found that the filter was twisted and broke apart (its a cartridge type filter). :( Well, that didn't help I'm sure! So now the lifter noise comes and goes, so I know its loosening up a bit. Changing lifters is a major deal on this car, so thats out of the question, and besides, I'm only planning on keeping it another 5 months or so.

I'm going to put 10W-40 in it to see if that helps, but I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with Marvel Mystery Oil or Lucas oil additives. I'm reading thay Lucas can work wonders on stuck lifters. I've also read some good stuff about Rislone, but I'm leary about it because its more of a cleaner.

Thoughts or suggestions?

Overhead cam with lifters?

petevw
03-26-2008, 01:40 PM
Overhead cam with lifters?

What?

bartonmd
03-26-2008, 03:16 PM
Overhead cam with lifters?

They're actually usually called "hydrolic valve adjusters" and take up the slack in finger follower OHC valvetrains, but basically, yes...

Mike

Doc Brown
03-26-2008, 04:21 PM
They're actually usually called "hydrolic valve adjusters" and take up the slack in finger follower OHC valvetrains, but basically, yes...

Mike

Exactly. Lots of "natural", soft, ticking is already going on between the valve train and fuel injectors. And the Catera service manual calls them lifters.

Doc Brown
03-26-2008, 04:28 PM
If your oil filter was twisted up like that, it was more than likely either over-pressurized by a REALLY cold start, or was plugged up... Either way, it's probably gone through the over-pressure filter bypass, and you've been running unfiltered oil to your top end. It's probably a piece of something stuck in a lifter (or rather, "hydrolic valve adjuster" if it's an OHC/finger follower system)... I had a Fram filter (I know I know... all I could find at the time) on my '85 Nighthawk 700S come apart on me, and found pieces of the cardboard end cap in a lifter... Since I had run it for awhile as the noise started, then got a little worse, the lifter had literally beat itself to sh*t, and had to be replaced... If it's a piece of sludge or something in a lifter, the Marvel or any of the detergents may get it out, but I wouldn't run it too much between now and when you put the stuff in...

Mike

I thought of that, and I am a little worried about it. Something tells me though that any piece of filter would be pretty small, if it didn't completely break up by the time it got that high in the system. Its actaully getting quieter the more I drive it, so I'm a little less worried.I don't have a choice but to drive it right now. The oil change seemed to help it a lot already.

bartonmd
03-26-2008, 04:45 PM
Exactly. Lots of "natural", soft, ticking is already going on between the valve train and fuel injectors. And the Catera service manual calls them lifters.

Ah... I have never read a caddy manual... the service manual for my old Nighthawk 700S called them "hydraulic valve adjusters"

Mike

Edit: question, though... in that vehicle, are they between the valve and the cam, moving with the valve (like a lifter), or are they just sitting in the head, pushing up on one end of a finger follower, with a cam pushin down on the middle, with a valve on the other end of the finger follower?